Author Topic: "fun yeast"  (Read 13369 times)

Offline SOGOAK

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"fun yeast"
« on: April 09, 2009, 07:19:42 PM »
As I read, learn, and pull off the training wheels in all grain, I have gotten interested in difference yeasts.

So far I have used:

WY1214 (Chimay) in a cranberry Chimay belgian ale that is great now and I am cellaring a case for the fall
WY2006 Bavarian Lager -Amber Lager was good and I have an Ofest about to go into lager conditioing

??? Brother Thelonius ??? I collected 5-6 bottle's dregs and added them to some starter.  I need to step it up when I have more starter thawed and boiled.  Great beer, Wanted to try propagation

WY3864 Unibroue -Going to try the following with this alleged "work Horse" yeast.  A starter, then a 5 gallon ramp up beer at about 7%, then a full blown tripple on that cake

I am picking up:
WY3789 Trappist Blend I'm going to try a couple things with this.  But not 100% decided
WY1272 for Denny Conn's Rye PA.  Then maybe another batch on 2450 when it comes back out this summer

I have used a couple types of white tubes too.  001, i think edinburgh, maybe one other, but I was too new to capture them.

I may also reuse a US-05 Cake on a big beer this summer -Maybe a Fred Bonjour IIPA.

Anyone have any other fun bubblin?
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Offline UselessBrewing

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Re: "fun yeast"
« Reply #1 on: April 13, 2009, 10:13:28 AM »
I have a few. I use to save a sample of every batch I made, but Found it was taking up more room in the beer fridge than beer. So I pitched everything but the yeasts that I use frequently + the good stuff.

Here is my short list along with the beers that I make with them... :  ;D
Fat Tire WYXL1792 (Flat Tire, go figure)
Rogue Packman ?_? (IPA Heaven)
Abbey Ale WLP530 (GoodBeer)
Hefeweizen Ale WLP300 (Ms. Wit)
Scottish Ale #1728 (To Don a Kilt)
Edme Ale ?_? (Edme My Love)
Pilsner Lager WLP800 (Bohemian Rhapsody)

I am also participating in a beer-swap with "The Aleuminati" called "The Inoculator". There are 13 brewers and each of us brewed an ESB but used different yeasts. Im hoping to get some good yeast from those beers.

Cheers
Preston
The woodpecker pecks, Not to annoy, But to survive!

dhaenerbrewer

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Re: "fun yeast"
« Reply #2 on: April 25, 2009, 11:40:04 PM »
Nice  yeast list UselessBrewing. Do you keep them on slants? I currently maintain the following strains, but the list will grow.

WLP001 - The tried and true White Labs California Ale Yeast
WLP510 - White Labs Bastogne Ale Yeast - A wonderful, high attenuating Belgian Ale Yeast.
DH001 (My own number) - Westlvteren Yeast, from Abbey St. Sixtus Barleywine directly from the monastery in Belgium. A wonderfully estery and highly attenuating yeast. It makes incredible high gravity belgian ales.



Offline UselessBrewing

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Re: "fun yeast"
« Reply #3 on: April 27, 2009, 07:20:47 AM »
Nice  yeast list UselessBrewing. Do you keep them on slants?
Thanks! I have not done slants yet, but have red up on them and decided that will be a future project! I currently wash them and put them aside for later use. I do need to start this project. My attempt at keeping a first gen yeast viable has been a challenge to say the least.

Cheers
Preston
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dhaenerbrewer

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Re: "fun yeast"
« Reply #4 on: April 27, 2009, 10:22:56 AM »
Preston -
 
Yes, I do keep them on slants. It's VERY easy, but to someone who is doing it for the first time, it can sound like a daunting challenge. Check out this link: http://www.maltosefalcons.com/tech/MB_Raines_Guide_to_Yeast_Culturing.php . Mary Beth is a genius, and helped me out many times in my professional career. You don't have to go to quite the extremes as she outlines in that article, but there is a lot of good information there. Feel free to pick my brain as much as you'd like about culturing. It's quick, fun and easy. You can also do it for relatively cheap, and will save you a lot of money in the long run. Yeast will easily stay healthy and viable on a slant in the refrigerator for 6-12 months, and all you have to do to keep them happy is transfer some to a new slant and let it grow for a few days an voila! I like being a yeast farmer.  :)

Darin

Offline UselessBrewing

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Re: "fun yeast"
« Reply #5 on: May 05, 2009, 07:51:25 AM »
I just put a fat tire washed yeast into a starter Sunday. It was a year old and was one of my first few yeast washing's. As of this morning, I have no activity and I'm hopping it will be viable. I have one other that is the same age if this one does not work.

"Theoretically" When you use slants, you could keep them going for years correct? Would each time you re-slant a yeast be considered a second generation, and one more tick towards the 5 total?

Using slants, I could take a few cc's from any new culture and put it in a few slants to keep it viable for the next batches right?

I'm Seriously thinking about getting a slant farm going... The space alone in the beer fridge would be worth it!

I'm sure I will have more questions.

Cheers
Preston
The woodpecker pecks, Not to annoy, But to survive!

dhaenerbrewer

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Re: "fun yeast"
« Reply #6 on: May 05, 2009, 06:01:21 PM »
Do it Preston. I think maybe your yeast is dead, but however, I have seen serious lag times, especially for yeast that has been sitting dormant for so long. As long as you were very clean, and you don't get any bacterial infection, you should be ok. Do you have a stir plate? I would highly recommend one for purposes of growing your washed yeast, and it is absolutely necessary when growing yeast from slants.  You can build your own for about 30 bucks. There's an example on brewiki. I used a 25k ohm potentiometer, and it doesn't slow the fan down a heck of a lot, but it works. If you want good speed control, go for a 500k ohm potentiometer.

Yes, theoretically when you use slants you can keep them going indefinitely. The yeast doesn't replicate enough on a slant to iterate the generation or cause mutation so you should be ok. One thing you will want to do is select colonies before growing. That is: take a sterile inoculation loop and grab some yeast from the slant; then wipe it gently all over the top of a petri dish with sterile wort agar. If there is any wild yeast, it will colonize. You should select the healthiest, milkiest looking colony, and using another sterile inoculation loop transfer that to about 5-10 mL of sterile wort. After 1 day transfer the entire slurry to 50mL of sterile wort and stir constantly on a stir plate. You can continue to add 50-100mL of sterile wort daily, depending on how your yeast is growing, until you have a total of about 800mL of starter, and that should be enough for 10 gallons.

As far as culturing new slants, any time you culture yeast from a slant, you should first inoculate 1-2 new slants so you always have a few on hand. If you wait until it's a slurry you would have to iterate the generations, as the yeast will start to mutate at that point. I always keep a minimum of 3 slants of each strain on hand.

Ask away Preston, yeast is my passion. :)

Darin

Offline UselessBrewing

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Re: "fun yeast"
« Reply #7 on: May 08, 2009, 12:16:17 PM »
I'm happy to report that My Fat Tire yeast is alive and well on my stirplate.

I just recieved my order of petri dishes, 21x70 glass vials with screw top (75 of them), inoculating needle, bulb pipet, alcohol flamer, 21mm Slant Rack, and a porcelain mortar/pestle (because it was $3!). Not a bad buy for $30 and $6 shipping! Not Ebay, they were to way to expensive! Scientific Equipment of Houston had the best prices and they were local, so fast shipping without the expense!

Are you ready to play 20 questions? :)

Where do you get your agar? I heard you can get it at a pharmacy so that's where I will try first. I will be making some agar wort this weekend. I want to be ready to colonize my Fat Tire Yeast in 4 petris dishes to make sure I have a solid sample.

Can you store sterile slants without being inoculated at room temp?

When the agar is firm in the vial, how do you get it out so you can add it to a the 5-10 mL of Wort?

Do you store your pre-boiled wort in a container of some kind to aid in stepping up the volume?

Do you use Starsan when using agar or just flame everything?

Thanks for the help.

Cheers
Preston
The woodpecker pecks, Not to annoy, But to survive!

dhaenerbrewer

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Re: "fun yeast"
« Reply #8 on: May 08, 2009, 02:11:02 PM »
Ready and willing. Here goes.

It's always a good idea to let your slants, whether inoculated or not at room temperature for 3-5 days. If they are inoculated, you want the yeast to grow, and once you have a nice colony, store them in the fridge. If you are just pouring slants for future use (I usually pour 5-10 at a time so I have them handy when I need them), go ahead and let them sit at room temperature for 3 days, and if nothing grows they are sterile; store them in the fridge until you need them. If something does grow, throw away the agar and try again.

When inoculating from a slant, use a disposable, sterile inoculation loop to "scoop" up some of the colony and smear it on a plate. After 3-4 days you should have a well formed colony on the plate, at which time use another inoculation loop to "scoop" up some of the good colony and mix the loop around in 5-10mL of sterile wort (I use an old White Labs yeast vial from a 5 gallon pitch, they are autoclavable so you can put in your wort and sterilize the whole thing).

I usually make up 1 Liter of wort when I am ready to start growing yeast. I sanitize the container (again, autoclavable), boil the wort, put the wort in the container, and sterilize the whole thing in a pressure cooker, along with the slants and white labs tube.

I flame EVERYTHING, and work in a flame zone with an updraft. I have a range that has a flat top, so I sanitize the whole thing really good, turn on the hood, and light a small propane torch, which I work underneath when pouring plates, pouring slants, inoculating slants, etc. The flame, along with the hood on the range provides a nice updraft, to prevent bacteria from falling into the plates, etc.

And oh yeah, either wear a dust mask or don't breathe. Your mouth is full of nasty bacteria. Hope that helps.

Oh yeah, I just get my agar from MoreBeer. You should be able to get it pretty cheap from the same laboratory supply company that you got all your other equipment from. It is essential that you get the proper consistency; so if you get it from a pharmacy make sure it tells you the exact water/agar ratio. I cannot stress enough the importance of this. Good luck!

Darin
« Last Edit: May 08, 2009, 02:13:10 PM by dhaenerbrewer »

Offline SOGOAK

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Re: "fun yeast"
« Reply #9 on: May 09, 2009, 07:48:55 AM »
Darin, I am still in the real early phases of yeast ranching and only started out of $ savings and experienced brewers telling me how easy it is.  Both my repitches have gone well. But my attempt to culture the brother thelonius yeast did not go well.  I need to write the brewer to see if they use a secondary yeast for conditioning or any other processing methods.  If I step up my efforts, I'll probably post some questions.
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Offline MaltLicker

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Re: "fun yeast"
« Reply #10 on: May 09, 2009, 08:22:43 AM »
Darin, I am still in the real early phases of yeast ranching and only started out of $ savings and experienced brewers telling me how easy it is. 

That's what I thought when I got into home brewing......."wish I didn't know now what I didn't know then." 


dhaenerbrewer

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Re: "fun yeast"
« Reply #11 on: May 09, 2009, 10:32:09 AM »
I need to write the brewer to see if they use a secondary yeast for conditioning or any other processing methods.

I can save you the time and tell you that it is the same yeast as primary fermentation. I was pouring at the Andersen Valley Beer Festival 3 years ago when they debuted that beer, and North Coast was two booths down from me. I got to chat with the brewmaster for quite some time. It is in fact the same yeast. Culturing from a bottle doesn't always work, it's a crap shoot. You never know if the yeast will wake back up. It's always best to start very small to give your yeast a fighting chance.

Darin

Offline SOGOAK

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Re: "fun yeast"
« Reply #12 on: May 11, 2009, 08:19:52 PM »
I think I over stressed them a little. I will try again, we love that brew.
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Offline UselessBrewing

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Re: "fun yeast"
« Reply #13 on: May 19, 2009, 09:49:01 AM »
Well finding a local source of Agar has been challenging. So I am off to a slow start on this project. Not knowing how much of this I would use, I found 2# for $49 ( http://www.houseofnutrition.com/733739064158.html ) It seemed like a good deal with $5 shipping. Anyhow as soon as it shows up I will start on this project. I am attaching my .bsm for the Agar. let me know what you think. The Mix will be 1.033. I did not feel it should be any stronger than that. If you think 1.033 is to strong Darin let me know.

I will be taking your advise and do this on the stove with the vent on and the torch lit. I figure gloves and a mask will also help.

The notes field are where I put the following:
Sterilize the slant tubes and Plates prior to use. Boil water LME and agar for 20 min. Flame loop, plates, and tubes before use.  Add agar solution to slant tubes and Plates and seal. Let stand at room temp for 3 days. If no bacteria has grown on them, they are ready to use.
Inoculate 3 plates and let stand at room temp for 3 days (Should be a creamy white). Remove a culture from the best plate with a loop and inoculate 3 slants and label. Let stand at room temp for 3 days. Refrigerate for up to a year.
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dhaenerbrewer

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Re: "fun yeast"
« Reply #14 on: May 19, 2009, 11:03:32 AM »
That all looks great Preston. I think 1.033 should be fine. I generally go with 1.049 (12 Plato) but 1.033 should be just fine. I've attached the worksheet I use to calculate how much of everything I need based on desired gravity and volume. I think 2# of agar will last you a very long time. You don't need much (12 grams to make 1 Liter). Good luck!

Darin

 

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