Author Topic: Default Mash Profile Bug  (Read 127 times)

Offline BrewLizard

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Default Mash Profile Bug
« on: February 22, 2021, 04:02:24 PM »
I found this out the hard way after my water volumes have been wrong multiple times.

If you have set a default mash profile, then you edit that profile (e.g. to manually put in the pre-boil volume, because the "calculate boil-off automatically" always gives the wrong number), then the OLD parameter persists next time you create a recipe with your default mash profile.

In other words, whatever you have set as your default mash profile in settings, appears to be a copy of that profile with whatever settings it had at the time, rather than specifying a reference to the profile you want to use. The workaround - after you edit a profile - is to remove it as your default profile and then re-select it as your default profile.

It's an easy trap, especially when tuning your system...

Edit: en-dashes became "?", so changed to hyphens.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2021, 08:58:51 PM by BrewLizard »

Offline BOB357

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Re: Default Mash Profile Bug
« Reply #1 on: February 22, 2021, 05:07:49 PM »
By setting a default you're telling the system to use the values defined in the default setting unless the user overrides those values. Default values should remain as originally defined unless a new default is set. This is a standard in software and not particular to BeerSmith.

The boiloff is set in your equipment profile, as are several other values that define your system. BeerSmith uses your inputs, within various profiles, as a basis for calculations. The accuracy of these inputs determines the accuracy of calculated values.
Bob

Offline Kevin58

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Re: Default Mash Profile Bug
« Reply #2 on: February 22, 2021, 06:48:12 PM »
Recipe files are independent and stand alone. If you make a change to any profile after a recipe is created and want that new profile to be used you must go back to the recipe and make the change.
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Offline BrewLizard

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Re: Default Mash Profile Bug
« Reply #3 on: February 22, 2021, 09:15:17 PM »
By setting a default you're telling the system to use the values defined in the default setting unless the user overrides those values. Default values should remain as originally defined unless a new default is set. This is a standard in software and not particular to BeerSmith.

Ah, it's a "feature" rather than a bug.  ;)

I would agree with you if I was talking about a parameter (e.g. grain absorption), but I'm not. I'm talking about a profile. Saving off a copy of this profile with the same name, and having it exist only in the preferences is not standard in software.

Doing it this way has two awful traps when editing your default equipment profile:
1. You edit it from the Equipment Profiles area. Then you run into the trap I found, so you need to remember to then go to settings and remove and re-add the profile.
OR
2. You edit it straight from Beersmith->Preferences, which then doesn't update the original equipment profile. Meaning if you then change your default equipment profile to one of your other profiles, you've just lost your new settings to the aether. Or if you make a recipe and change the profile to something else, then change it back to the one with the same name as your default profile, it will have different parameters!

The user should not have to edit their parameters twice to get it to save correctly.

Software should not create another copy of a parameter file with the same name, but have it exist in a different state.

If config files did this in other applications, operating systems, etc. then things would break super quickly.

Recipe files are independent and stand alone. If you make a change to any profile after a recipe is created and want that new profile to be used you must go back to the recipe and make the change.

That's fine, but also not at all what I'm talking about.

I'm saying when you've specified your choice of default profile, and edit that profile, it doesn't persist in new recipes.

Offline BOB357

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Re: Default Mash Profile Bug
« Reply #4 on: Yesterday at 05:58:02 AM »
Correct. You need to select the edited profile as your new default if you want the change(s) to be part of the default profile.
Bob

Offline Oginme

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Re: Default Mash Profile Bug
« Reply #5 on: Yesterday at 06:42:43 AM »


I'm saying when you've specified your choice of default profile, and edit that profile, it doesn't persist in new recipes.

The way the software does its archiving is by making each recipe and independent record.  If you edit a profile (equipment, mash, carbonation, fermentation) within a recipe then those changes only affect that recipe.  If you edit it in your profile library, then the newly edited profile will not affect any recipe which are already using the old profile.

Further, if you have a recipe template which calls a given profile and you change the profile parameters in your profile library then the next time you use that recipe template it will still retain the old profile. 

To avoid any issues with wondering which version of a profile I have in a recipe, I append the update date to the name of the profile, i.e. 01B Anvil 6.5G [10L] (200402) 240v.  This way when i look at a recipe I can see when that profile was in use.

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Offline BrewLizard

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Re: Default Mash Profile Bug
« Reply #6 on: Yesterday at 01:04:02 PM »
Thanks Oginme. I understand that.

I'm specifically talking about the selection of "default" profile from the settings menu, and how it's not actually a reference to that profile, but rather a copy of it. Editing within a recipe staying within a recipe is fine.

Your workaround is a good idea, but I've unfortunately hit my limit of quirks with Beersmith.

I had a play around with Brewfather.app, and I'm going to jump ship. The behaviour I'm talking about doesn't happen in Brewfather. If you set a profile as default, it's a reference to that profile, rather than a new copy of it. It also lets you set defaults for other profiles (mash, fermentation), and it doesn't tell you to put your sparge salts in the mash, lol.

Anyway, you guys have a good community here, and it's good you've found software that works for you. Thanks for taking the time to reply to the thread.