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conglomeration of possibly unrelated incidents

makemorebeer

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I've been brewing for about three and a half years now and this last spring made the jump to all grain brewing.  I've gotten very good feedback on many of my Beers, both borrows recipes and one's I've written myself.  this weekend i was brewing a SMaSH IPA with a buddy of mine from a few hours away and we came to the conclusion between brewing and sampling each others beers from over the past six months that somethings up.

The first time it came up was after mashing we had 6.9 gal on the burner and were bringing to a boil.  this is always a game of cat an mouse for me. I have an 8gal. tallboy on a darkstar burner and the trick is to get it rolling without the foam boiling over.  this preboil foam has been a constant problem for me since i started extract brewing on my kitchen range a few years ago.  so i was talking to my buddy about this and he's like no.  i boil full volume on my gas range at home and i never have this foaming issue. 

So my first question is what could be causing the excessive foaming.  do others experience this?  is it water profile.  because that leads into my next question.

later that evening, and notably 5-10 beers, some roasted duck and Greek salad later, we were side by side comparing his Lemon Wheat against my Citrus Blonde.  his recipe was based on mine although the hops are different, the grain bill is very similar.  he used flaked wheat and pilsen extract, and mine used white wheat with pilsen extract, and he skipped a 5min. Citra hop addition.  but the lemon flavor in his is very much smoother and more pronounced.  then later again we sampled his Dry Irish Coffee Stout, again based off my recipe borrowed from a magazine.  again the coffee flavor was much more evident in his brew than my own. 

So my second question is, what could be causing his beers to show secondary flavors better than mine where as mine seem to be muted by the malt and hop flavors?  could it be a difference in water?  he uses tap water in his city, and i use well water at my home roughly 3 hours apart. 

Appreciate any help as we both strive to make the best beer we can and i'm left wondering if i'm doing something wrong, missing something, or is it simply my water. 
 
The foam at the start of boiling is hot break. It's normal and desirable. You control it by controlling your heat, or you can use a foam control product. Just a few drops will collapse all that foam. Your buddy either doesn't have enough heat or enough protein to get a foaming issue.

Secondary flavors have a huge number of factors that go into their perception. At the top of the list, though, is oxidation. A bit of oxidation may not present as papery or cardboard or vinous. Instead, it's more like looking through a dirty panoramic window. The view is still there, but the detail is missing.

The health of your yeast and quality of your fermentation are two common factors, as well. Even a little under attenuation can leave flavors a bit muddy. Fermentation that's too hot or allows a lot of blowoff can lose top notes to flavor. Again, the basics are there, but not as defined, like you noted.

The last point I'll make is that the simplest recipes often have the best flavors. More than two or three specialty malts and you really have to examine if there's a real reason for it all. Same with hops. It used to be that adding hops continuously to the boil was state of the art IPA. Now it's first wort, whirlpool and dry hop that create a ton of impact.
 
The IPA we did was actually my first time doing First Wort.  i'm curious how it'll be compared to other IPA's.  I agree though.  i'm not an everything and the kitchen sink type of brewer though.  when i write a recipe i make sure there is a reason ( at least in my own head) for the ingredient to be there.  I just recently started making Yeast starters as well which i think based on your answer may help a bit.  I should probably get some way to control fermentation temp that's better than the ambient temperature in my basement office. 

Back to the question though. how much oxidation is too much oxidation.  I move the bucket/carboy only twice, and even then only if i do a secondary.  when racking I take measures to avoid splashing and sloshing, and i bottle through a bottling bucket that i'm careful when i transfer into as well. 

So for the hot break, i'm fiddling with the heat until it settles before i start my boil or it'll boil over.  larger kettle, or foam control are my options?  But more importantly, i want it to do that.  see I thought hot break was just when adding hops and it flashes up quick and goes back down.

always learning more every day.



 
The other obvious question i didn't ask, is it bad to control the foaming with a foam control product.  would it affect flavor or quality would be my biggest concerns.
 
makemorebeer said:
The other obvious question i didn't ask, is it bad to control the foaming with a foam control product.  would it affect flavor or quality would be my biggest concerns.

Short answer; no. But if you are concerned you can also control the foam by keeping a spray bottle filled with nothing but water on hand. A spritz or two should knock it down.

Until I got a boil kettle big enough so that I didn't have to worry about it I just learned that I needed to stand by the pot when it got close to that point and be ready to turn the heat down and either stir or spray.

 
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